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Post by bluecanary on Jul 12, 2010 15:36:20 GMT -5
This isn't actually an interpretation of any song. Just some personal observations about song interpretation in general.
I take songs pretty much at face value so I don't find myself doing much interpretation. I also usually avoid reading other people's interpretations because I have found that once I read them it is hard for me to think about anything else and it has come close to ruining songs for me. (End of the Tour has particularly suffered from this which upsets me because I love that song).
I find interpretation to be a very curious thing since part of what is great about music is that a song can mean something different to every person. I can understand sharing what the song means to you but not trying put forth the definitive "meaning" of a song unless you are the song's author. And even then I don't think a song always has the same meaning for the writer as it does for the listener.
I also find it odd to think about interpreting TMBG songs because my feeling is that they are (for the most part) pretty literal. Especially the Linnell songs. And many of the ones that aren't are just nonsense that sounds good. Which is, in it's way, my own interpretation I suppose.
I have no particular point in this. Just felt like sharing.
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Post by fouroftwo on Jul 12, 2010 20:08:52 GMT -5
I don't mind interpretations, usually, but it does bother me a little when people don't take certain songs at face value. South Carolina is the best example I can think of at the moment: it's about a bicycle crash. It's possible that it's about our dependence on foreign oil or South Carolina's unfriendly bicycle laws, or even tort reform, I guess, but really it's about a guy who crashes his bike.
My favorite interpretations are the ones that are very clearly personal. Everyone interprets music according to their personal experiences, and it's fun to see how many different meanings one song can have to a slew of people. But songs can mean anything. Insisting that your own interpretation is EXACTLY what Flans/Linnell was thinking when he wrote the song can be tiresome.
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Post by bluecanary on Jul 13, 2010 0:06:04 GMT -5
I just got a bizarre one in my Google Alert today in which someone insisted that Stand On Your Own Head is written from the perspective of a bear rug looking out at the human world.
There are a few songs that have personal meanings to me but I guess I just don't think about songs in terms of meanings that much. I do sometimes, especially if the lyrics really confuse me. And I guess I sort of automatically put songs in categories based on subject: happy, sad, love song, death, break-up, etc.
But where do people come up with these far out interpretations? I guess it is just what comes to mind.
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Ana Ng
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Sapphire Bullets...
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Post by Ana Ng on Jul 13, 2010 13:54:11 GMT -5
I actually just wrote a REEALLY long interp of She's An Angel in which I pretty much said that, to me, it's about a lovesick guy who sees his girlfriend literally as an angel.
(Oh, and my friend Emmalee and I got really into interpreting Don't Let's Start. That was fun.)
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Post by a generic reality on Jul 21, 2010 20:57:46 GMT -5
some stuff would be weird to interpret.
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Post by lemita on Sept 25, 2010 17:16:55 GMT -5
Am I dredging up an old topic? Is this allowed on this forum? I'm always too self-conscious to post, haha.
See, Blue Canary, I think we've discussed this-- I think Linnell is more metaphorical. Snail Shell is far from literal. Man, It's So Loud In Here isn't literal either. Experimental Film is an extended metaphor. At least, they aren't literal in my opinion.
Flansburgh tends to write very stylistically, where he has a set sound he's trying to go for. I Can't Hide From My Mind, despite some really great wordplay, is definitely a literal song. Damn Good Times is fairly literal as well.
I mean, Dirt Bike has an elaborate metaphor, whereas Birdhouse is meant to be taken literally. There is some bending to this theory of Linnell/Flans lyrics.
And I too dislike when people attempt to interpret lyrics that are obviously meant exactly how they are. To me, Stand on Your Own Head means nothing. It's all nonsense lyrics.
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Post by admiralpants on Oct 1, 2010 16:16:12 GMT -5
mislih isn't literal? what's there to be figurative about it? what? I don't think that "I Can't Hide From My Mind" is literal at all. Um, really, how can you literally hide from your mind?
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Post by fouroftwo on Oct 1, 2010 21:50:03 GMT -5
I think it's worth considering that we might all be running on slightly different definitions for "literal." The problem with describing any song as either literal or metaphorical is the same problem we've already gone over: everybody has a different idea of what the song is actually about, so depending on your interpretation, it could be either. My best example is Unsupervised -- I think it's a metaphorical song because I don't think it's really about physically hitting your head, but rather growing up, but I could be completely wrong about that. There really is no correct interpretation of a song's literalness.
For the same reason, I don't think it's possible to label either Linnell or Flans, but I think of the most popular Linnell songs (Birdhouse, Purple Toupee, Ana Ng, etc.) as pretty literal.
On the other hand you have Puppet Head, the chorus of which was written by Linnell, and in his hands the song might've been literally about putting your hand inside a puppet head, but Flansburgh's verses make it metaphorical for me.
I would classify I Can't Hide From My Mind as metaphorical and MISLIH as ~90% literal, but again, that doesn't mean I'm right.
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Post by thatbluething on Oct 9, 2010 1:45:48 GMT -5
I think it's worth considering that we might all be running on slightly different definitions for "literal." The problem with describing any song as either literal or metaphorical is the same problem we've already gone over: everybody has a different idea of what the song is actually about, so depending on your interpretation, it could be either. Well said! I have a question. It isn't exactly on topic, but has to do with the discussion here somewhat. When any of you refer to a "Flansburgh song" or a "Linnell song", are you implying that they wrote that particular song or is your label based solely on who sings it? I ask because something I've pondered many times is whether or not the fact that one John sings lead in a song infers that he wrote the song. Do they each write their own songs and then perform them together? Do they write all songs together and then decide who will sing lead for a particular song? Or does it vary from song to song? I'm very interested in the song-writing process in general, and I've just often wondered what takes place during the birth of a song. I've never read or watched any interviews that provide any insight to this query, and I'm curious as to whether anyone here knows the answer.
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Post by fouroftwo on Oct 9, 2010 8:19:25 GMT -5
Somebody else will probably answer this more accurately, but the songs they sing are generally songs they've written. A few exceptions off the top of my head and by no means exhaustive:
The World's Address (written by Linnell, sung by Flans) Put Your Hand Inside The Puppet Head (Linnell wrote the chorus, Flans wrote the verses) Mink Car (collaboration)
I know I've read interviews where Linnell has mentioned that he comes up with the melody first and then fixes the lyrics, and I have a friend who speculated that the reason the Birdhouse Demo lyrics are so insane is that he was just using them as a sort of placeholder to get the melody out. I like that idea, mostly because the Demo lyrics are inexcusably weird to me, but I have no idea if it's true.
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Post by a generic reality on Oct 9, 2010 13:28:07 GMT -5
"Subliminal" exception, right?
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Post by bluecanary on Oct 10, 2010 0:47:54 GMT -5
Correct. Subliminal was written by Flans, sung by Linnell. So was Rat Patrol. Add Now That I Have Everything, Reprehensible, and When It Rains it Snows to the list of songs written by Linnell but sung by Flans. And My Evil Twin to the "collaboration" column. But Megan is absolutely correct. 9 times out of 10 which ever John sings the song, wrote the song. There are other exceptions I am sure. This interview here lays some pretty good ground work for their songwriting and recording process if you don't get lost in all the tech jargon. emusician.com/online_exclusive/conversing_giants_bonus2/
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Post by bluecanary on Oct 10, 2010 2:11:48 GMT -5
Back on the topic of song interpretation and literal vs metaphorical songs.
I think, Erin, that your post perfectly proves the point that different people interpret the same songs in different ways (because I only agree with about half of your assessments). And the beauty of TMBG songs is that they leave so much room for those interpretations.
Ultimately, I don't think it comes down to "this song is literal, this song is a metaphor" or "Linnell writes metaphorically, Flans writes literally" (or vice versa). There is no one right answer. It's all in how each individual person hears each song, factoring in all of their personal experiences and preferences to find what that song means to them.
And I, personally, choose to take most of their songs literally because I don't really go in for interpretation. Maybe I just don't want to have to think that hard. I don't know.
I do agree with Megan though, in that I enjoy hearing about the personal meanings people find in songs. The type of interpretations where people relate the lyrics back to their own lives. Those I find rather wonderful just because they are so personal. I could write you all a wonderful interpretation of Museum of Idiots as it relates to my life for the last 8 years.
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Post by thatbluething on Oct 11, 2010 13:48:55 GMT -5
Interesting! Thanks for responding, everyone! I know I've read interviews where Linnell has mentioned that he comes up with the melody first and then fixes the lyrics, and I have a friend who speculated that the reason the Birdhouse Demo lyrics are so insane is that he was just using them as a sort of placeholder to get the melody out. I like that idea, mostly because the Demo lyrics are inexcusably weird to me, but I have no idea if it's true. I've read that, too (referring to your first sentence there.) I actually looked up the demo lyrics on the wiki for the first time after reading this, and I really like them! ;D Just out of curiosity, how do you know that the specific songs all of you mentioned were written by one John and sung by the other, a collaboration, etc.? Did they address it in interviews? And Kelly, that was an excellent interview! Even though I didn't know any of the tech jargon (as you mentioned), I found myself wishing I did and thought the things they were talking about were interesting, nonetheless. And it did provide some insight to their songwriting process. Thank you. As far as the song interpretation and literal/figurative lyrics, I think I've made it pretty clear where I stand on the subject. (Though, maybe I haven't...making myself clear isn't always a strong point of mine. Rambling, on the other hand, is something I'm quite good at. I apologize for that. ) Anyway, I agree with Megan and Kelly that different people interpret songs in different ways depending on their experiences and preferences, and that there's no categorizing either John or any song as strictly metaphorical or literal. I'll even go so far as to say that I take an individual TMBG song differently at different times, depending on my mood. This possibility is one of the many things I love about their music. And the personal interpretations do sound lovely, though I don't believe I've ever actually read one. Care to share your Museum Of Idiots one, Kelly?
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Post by bluecanary on Oct 14, 2010 0:49:43 GMT -5
Mostly those songs were mentioned either in some interview or another or on stage as having been written by the other (or both). As for how I know that information, it's all TMBW. There is a very handy Swapped Vocals category for just those songs.
And my Museum of Idiots story is a little personal for public internet sharing but I'll email it to you Jamie, when I have a free minute :-)
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